Glaber's Ban and anything Sandwichface related ig

Okay, so I’ve been rambling on about this entire situation for a while now and it appears that I’ve reach my ending point, I think I have said my thoughts on this matter just about enough times, I’ve found out some… interesting things about this person I was defending

I will say though, I’m a bit more understanding on why he got booted in the first place, not because he was just mean but for things he did in the past as well

I already know he doesn’t stand by this anymore, and I think he’s not going to miss this place judging on his last video

I’m not the most knowledgeable on this topic, so I don’t think I have the right to continue my banter anymore really

So that’s that for me

DylanDude said:

My video on Transflower Zone. Back when it was unlisted (although links were available in the OS), he posted a disapproving comment on it. He has been blocked from my channel ever since.

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Oh, damn. I took a peek and couldn't find it, what was he saying exactly? I just want to ensure I'm not making any broad strokes and accusing him of something he hasn't done in regards to it, there's been a lot of times in the past with my experiences online where things may get misconstrued and telephone'd to extreme proportions, so I just want to make sure before I take the information with me. Apologies if this is a sensitive subject.

just kinda putting my thoughts here 2 get em out somewhere, idk if I’ll keep responding, maybe I’ll get banned for being on a high horse or some shit who knows

This whole convo has genuinely made me shocked, I was planning on taking a small break from the comm but holy shit the aggression here is unreal. I don’t even have the energy to look into everything, all I do know is that it’s not worth this
I’ve had this vibe ever since Avalice was banned from oldc something has felt *off*
Like it’s not even about who’s in the right or wrong for me it’s about like this basic level of understanding that everyone’s a person that feels like every post is walking on eggshells between two dueling sides of the community

I’ve fr made friends here, there’s GREAT people here, but there is a fucking TOXIC energy that permeates nearly every aspect of this community, and it’s really REALLY hard to not feed into it
This isn’t a criticism towards one side either, and I don’t even know what the hell the solution is, I can’t tell you what needs to change, or what specifically is wrong, only that this community is just. Kind of sad to watch

nearly every time a picture has been painted of someone negatively I’ve approached them and they have been nice, this community is full of nice people but there’s some sort of energy that just makes everything angrier
I really don’t know what the issue is, but I can’t name another modding comm like this, maybe it’s a result of devs being too connected to modding? Idfk
All I know is it’s sad to see a comm full of incredibly kind creative people become this hateful battleground ig

And again I don’t know what the answer is hell half the reason I’m typing this comment is as a vent, but shit if it ain’t upsetting

I been spending time in other communities for other shit and just like. It’s so much happier, doing charity events and shit, and idk if that’s even comparable but, there’s something fundamentally wrong here and I don’t know what the hell it is. I just know I kinda don’t wanna deal with it rn. As much as I love the talented creative ppl in this comm just. This energy is too much to deal w anymore

I’m prob talking in circles so I’ll stop here. I just needed somewhere to get my thoughts out. Yeah.

SP Moves Enjoyer said:

Like I said before, his entire YouTube channel is proof that he’s changed as a person after that point

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I would argue the opposite. Even ignoring the blatant clownery he displayed in this thread, as I stated in my earlier reply as time went on he really laid it thick in his videoswith his distaste for "nu-STJR" and Kart Krew (which we still don't have a real explanation for). While I will give you that his newer videos could be a lot more fair and constructive they still tended to veer back into old habits of being needlessly hyperbolic. Consider that he hated one level in the last OLDC so much that he made an entire video separate from the main OLDC review just to shit on it.

CILC said:

I’ve fr made friends here, there’s GREAT people here, but there is a fucking TOXIC energy that permeates nearly every aspect of this community, and it’s really REALLY hard to not feed into it
This isn’t a criticism towards one side either, and I don’t even know what the hell the solution is, I can’t tell you what needs to change, or what specifically is wrong, only that this community is just. Kind of sad to watch

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It's probably a consequence of this game being very, very, very old, leading to a wide age range of individuals who all have wildly different ideas and opinions on various aspects. It reminds me a lot of the Sonic fandom as a whole with its own elitism issues. My advice is to, as I suggested earlier, pay the drama no mind and keep working on your own projects as it is a great deal better for your mental health. That said if such a thing necessitates stepping out of the community that is also fair; just as no one is forcing you to partake in the drama, you don't have to partake in the community.

Rolly Polly Pal said:

While I will give you that his newer videos could be a lot more fair and constructive they still tended to veer back into old habits of being needlessly hyperbolic.

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It's quite clear you haven't watched.

PeneBoi said:

It's quite clear you haven't watched.

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But I have. I quite literally stated as such in one of my first posts in this thread and additionally provided an example in the previous one to back my point up.

pinyan_ said:

Oh, damn. I took a peek and couldn't find it, what was he saying exactly? I just want to ensure I'm not making any broad strokes and accusing him of something he hasn't done in regards to it, there's been a lot of times in the past with my experiences online where things may get misconstrued and telephone'd to extreme proportions, so I just want to make sure before I take the information with me. Apologies if this is a sensitive subject.

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YouTube automatically removes comments from blocked users. It was "Mystic was right" and given that he uses the Old Guard to voice his disapproval of modern SRB2 content, I think the message is pretty clear. Especially since he went out of his way to leave his thoughts on an unlisted video.

CILC said:

just kinda putting my thoughts here 2 get em out somewhere, idk if I’ll keep responding, maybe I’ll get banned for being on a high horse or some shit who knows

This whole convo has genuinely made me shocked, I was planning on taking a small break from the comm but holy shit the aggression here is unreal. I don’t even have the energy to look into everything, all I do know is that it’s not worth this
I’ve had this vibe ever since Avalice was banned from oldc something has felt *off*
Like it’s not even about who’s in the right or wrong for me it’s about like this basic level of understanding that everyone’s a person that feels like every post is walking on eggshells between two dueling sides of the community

I’ve fr made friends here, there’s GREAT people here, but there is a fucking TOXIC energy that permeates nearly every aspect of this community, and it’s really REALLY hard to not feed into it
This isn’t a criticism towards one side either, and I don’t even know what the hell the solution is, I can’t tell you what needs to change, or what specifically is wrong, only that this community is just. Kind of sad to watch

nearly every time a picture has been painted of someone negatively I’ve approached them and they have been nice, this community is full of nice people but there’s some sort of energy that just makes everything angrier
I really don’t know what the issue is, but I can’t name another modding comm like this, maybe it’s a result of devs being too connected to modding? Idfk
All I know is it’s sad to see a comm full of incredibly kind creative people become this hateful battleground ig

And again I don’t know what the answer is hell half the reason I’m typing this comment is as a vent, but shit if it ain’t upsetting

I been spending time in other communities for other shit and just like. It’s so much happier, doing charity events and shit, and idk if that’s even comparable but, there’s something fundamentally wrong here and I don’t know what the hell it is. I just know I kinda don’t wanna deal with it rn. As much as I love the talented creative ppl in this comm just. This energy is too much to deal w anymore

I’m prob talking in circles so I’ll stop here. I just needed somewhere to get my thoughts out. Yeah.

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Yeah, I can tell why explaining things is hardly difficult to construct. Given that energy is needed in certain conversations.

DylanDude said:

YouTube automatically removes comments from blocked users. It was "Mystic was right" and given that he uses the Old Guard to voice his disapproval of modern SRB2 content, I think the message is pretty clear. Especially since he went out of his way to leave his thoughts on an unlisted video.

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My apologies, I'm not super in-the-know with the whole Mystic debacle so the message isn't clear for me, sadly.

He uses Mystic as an example to disapprove of newer SRB2 add-ons, so that is transphobic? Or is Mystic themselves a transphobe and it is being connotated that Sandwich is one for using them as an example? I may be understanding this wrong but it sounds, from what you are saying, that he is using Mystic as a mouthpiece to emphasize his point that modern SRB2 content has his major disapproval, rather than encapsulating Mystic's (assumedly, please correct me if I'm wrong) transphobic beliefs?

Just trying to understand as the information provided is a little confusing for myself, cool to drop it if it's too much for you.

CILC said:

I’ve fr made friends here, there’s GREAT people here, but there is a fucking TOXIC energy that permeates nearly every aspect of this community, and it’s really REALLY hard to not feed into it
This isn’t a criticism towards one side either, and I don’t even know what the hell the solution is, I can’t tell you what needs to change, or what specifically is wrong, only that this community is just. Kind of sad to watch

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Make no mistake, this kind of thing is just what happens when troublemakers in a community decide their contribution will be riling up (poorly informed) drama and misinformation whenever they get the chance.

I think it's already passed out of most people in this thread here's present memory, but I'm going to remind everyone again:
We're discussing the person who, when the MB got hacked a bit back, tried to send as much personal information as he could collect on SRB2 and KartKrew staff to the hackers.
(social media accounts, dating profiles, selfies, furaffinities, etc)
ZERO provocation. None of us knew the guy.
(This information was only exposed because he chose the wrong person to DM when asking it to be passed along)

He was actually given grace for that, and now everyone can see how he chose to spend that.

damn wtf what is wrong with sandwichface, never would i have thought the guy who made that thok video would pull something like this

having lurked within this thread since it started, it does feel weird how he got banned just now. because what he said within this thread was not very ban worthy i think, even if he was being toxic and unreasonable. he has done acts far worse in the past than anything that happened in here, so why was he banned here and now and not like, way earlier or maybe later? i guess his ultimate ban just felt a bit unsatisfying. in the end though, his ban was deserved and it was bound to happen sooner or later. he was given many chances to change and he never did.
anyways, yeah engaging in debates and drama over the internet can be tiring, even if none of it matters in the grand scheme of things. sometimes you just gotta take a break and focus on what actually matters. i think the community will get more chill again with sandwichface gone, as he was sparking many unnecessary debates using his YouTube channel, and while he did raise some compelling points he often just spread misinformation for the sake of it. (i personally found it confusing how he was constantly hating on "nu-stjr" and charyb without ever having tried to explain why.) and in the end, you can just choose not to engage with drama if you do not feel prepared to, and you will end up having a much better time with the community.
these are my two cents on all this, yeah.

Keep in mind that even "compelling points" can often just be strawmen. Most of the staff (and devs) are very open minded flexible people, and attempting to make some big show of "controversy" is largely just posturing. Talk to your local devs. Talk to your local staff. (If you don't already know) you'll realize pretty fast that they're just friendly people who grew up in the community too

Don't fall into the trap of thinking their thoughts and opinions on stuff are accurately represented by some content creator who never spoke to them going off in a YouTube video.

Kirbymario said:

damn wtf what is wrong with sandwichface, never would i have thought the guy who made that thok video would pull something like this

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Tbh idk what's with been happening with me lately but each time, I get slightly bad vibes with someone most times they do heinous actions like this a couple of months or a year later, but I never talk about that with others because I'm a bit scared I might say something stupid and completely not get the situation, it's what got me banned from the SRB2 vanilla discord the first time(I was about one year or two years over the required age to join the discord and discord in general at the time), but I'm getting a bit off topic, so....

Man. I felt like I was watching a crime documentary or something along the lines of that reading this.

I honestly think Sandwichface should have been banned much earlier than he was. He had already made it abundantly clear years ago that he didn't intend to contribute to the community in any positive or amicable way, and giving him second and third chances only gave him more opportunities to disturb the peace and cause strife. Digging up personal information on staff members and sending it to hackers would have been the final straw for me. If I had the authority to I would have gotten law enforcement involved.

aquaponiee said:

it does feel weird how he got banned just now. because what he said within this thread was not very ban worthy i think, even if he was being toxic and unreasonable. he has done acts far worse in the past than anything that happened in here, so why was he banned here and now and not like, way earlier or maybe later? i guess his ultimate ban just felt a bit unsatisfying. in the end though, his ban was deserved and it was bound to happen sooner or later. he was given many chances to change and he never did.

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You somewhat answered your own question here. It's not so much that what he said specifically in this thread was bannable, it's more like he's been inching himself closer to the line for quite some time now and this is when the culminated result of this inching over the course of years was him finally crossing said line. It's like poking a bear. Doing it a few times might not provoke the bear, and the poke that finally does probably isn't any different from the ones that came before, but the end result is still the bear ceasing to tolerate the poking any longer and finally doing something about it.

In this case, Sandwich was being very specifically given an opportunity to talk about what his actual beef was and why, and instead he decided to laser focus on what all evidence points to being an outright falsehood about Charyb betraying his trust and breaching a contract despite her never actually agreeing to said contract and him making a different agreement with her instead, and her still not actually doing anything to wrong him through the entire thing. Falsely playing the victim card when being given a very specifically outlined opportunity to mend bridges instead of burning them isn't exactly putting your best foot forward. He was given this opportunity, and he chose to burn the bridge instead of mend it.

We often get conditioned into thinking it dishonest to say anything other than both sides likely sharing part of the blame, but I find it hard for me to find fault with STJr for their decision here considering their very clear, deliberate, and openly public attempt to sit down and reason with him. They went out of their way to give him a stage and a spotlight and handed him the mike to make his case, and he went out of his way to use this opportunity to spit in their faces and act like he was the one being wronged, and laser focused on Charyb especially for some reason despite the two barely knowing each other.

I don't know what was going on in his head, I honestly struggle to understand a lot of what he did and why, but it seems apparent to me that he was either disinterested in avoiding drama for some reason, or perhaps even deliberately fanned it. I don't want to outright accuse him of anything, but it is a basic fact that he is a content creator and there's little that boosts engagement better than a drama story. Even if he wasn't deliberately sparking drama for the sake of growing his channel, it's hard to deny he has been experiencing growth because of it. A pretty decent chunk of his followers seem to be young and impressionable and as such don't wait to hear both sides of the story before leaping to his defense, and he seems perfectly content in allowing that to remain the status quo. Controversy sells whether it's intentional or not.

Mostly directed at pages 7-8 of this thread: I very much dislike the term “Nu-STJr” given its origins, and I would prefer if people did not use it to refer to the current devs.

XtremeXavier said:

Mostly directed at pages 7-8 of this thread: I very much dislike the term “Nu-STJr” given its origins, and I would prefer if people did not use it to refer to the current devs.

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Apologies. I tossed the term around a bit myself but it was mainly in the context of when sandwichface was using it. I also hate the term, feels very 4channy if that makes sense.

XtremeXavier said:

Mostly directed at pages 7-8 of this thread: I very much dislike the term “Nu-STJr” given its origins, and I would prefer if people did not use it to refer to the current devs.

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Apologize, I also toss around the term to myself. I just wanted to refer the current devs, except, I realized that, it's kind of hurtful to the developers themselves.

Rolly Polly Pal said:

I also hate the term, feels very 4channy if that makes sense.

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Agree, It has this feeling of roughness and disrespect to the creators.

CILC said:

nearly every time a picture has been painted of someone negatively I’ve approached them and they have been nice, this community is full of nice people but there’s some sort of energy that just makes everything angrier
I really don’t know what the issue is, but I can’t name another modding comm like this, maybe it’s a result of devs being too connected to modding? Idfk
All I know is it’s sad to see a comm full of incredibly kind creative people become this hateful battleground ig

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Perhaps the existence of 11-page threads talking about people who have been banned does not help (in my opinion this thread should've started to wind down after the staff posted the receipts on why the bans took place).

What does help me and would probably help a lot of others is to try to not get too involved in fandom drama. Airing your opinion in fine, but getting into a deeper back & forth discussion of this type is probably not as healthy as focusing on the game and modding. I will also note that talking about banned users to this extent also gives them free publicity and notoriety, which means they can use that to feel justified in their actions if they are reading.